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 Conversations Toward a New World View: Huna Wisdom 
Interview with Dr. Serge King
   as interviewed by Russell E. DiCarlo

Then if we start examining that, we may find that these ideas are built upon even deeper ideas of fear of rejection because the person may have experienced criticism in one form or another. They made the interpretation that that meant they were not liked, and they weren't liked because they weren't good, and the interpretations build up. We might find if we go even deeper than that, it is built upon an original decision which is, "The world is a dangerous place."

DiCarlo: You have stated that all complexes are built upon the fundamental premise of helplessness and insecurity and that they can be removed by the development of true power. Could you explain that and define what true power is?

King: True power comes from trust in the source of all things or the source that is within each one of us. Power is influence. It is not control. A lot of people have tried to use control and that's just a technique that doesn't work very well. Power is the influence to move or change things. True power is the connection with the power that's actually doing that.

DiCarlo: So how does that enable us to remove these complexes?

King: Once you start assuming, accepting or even practicing the idea that one's source of power exists and you can connect with it, then by learning or practising the trust of it, and letting it operate, trust builds. The more you connect with that and the more you receive feedback that it is present and operating in your life, the more secure you begin to feel. It's a process that can happen quickly on occasion, but more often, it happens over a long period of time because of that peeling away process that I've described.

DiCarlo: Do these complexes serve any useful purpose?

King: Yes. Their purpose is to provide security. All of these erroneous interpretations are made, and then behavior is based upon those interpretations. The subconscious mind is always trying to protect you physically and emotionally, but it is sometimes in a bind because it is trying to use what it basically knows, let's say in the DNA, and it has to, by its nature, combine that with learned information. That's where we sometimes get into problems.

DiCarlo: Isn't it the aim of psychoanalysis to bring these complexes up to the surface of our conscious awareness.....?

King: Yes, and sometimes, that's helpful. But awareness alone doesn't produce change. There has to be a decision. Where psychoanalysis works, is where awareness happens, and the person makes a different decision. When psychoanalysis doesn't work, it's because there is awareness but no decision.

DiCarlo: Simply deciding you are going to behave in a different way...?

King: only the first step, of course. Then you have to actually start behaving differently.

DiCarlo: And what prevents us from doing that?

King: Fear.

DiCarlo: Aren't some of these complexes so deeply rooted that it requires that we do a lot of personal work in order to surmount them?

King: Some of these complexes have so much fear, that it requires that we do that peeling away. And that's the main problem. The more a decision has been based upon fear, the more difficult, because it takes a great leap of faith to get totally beyond that. Sometimes an event happens that allows an individual to break through all of that, like some of these life after death experiences. Sometimes the conversion to a new religion can do it because there is such emotional power present at the time that the energy produces a radical shift. This can be a positive development, but sometimes a person just trades one fear for another however.

DiCarlo: According to the kaHunas-those who are the masters of the Huna practice- what is the cause of poor health and disease? How might we heal ourselves?

King: All illness and disease is intended to serve a purpose. It is the subconscious trying to get your attention, to inform you that some way you are behaving, some way you are thinking, some way you are doing, isn't working. The way to heal is to use everything that you can to change. This is vitally so much of modern Western medicine, doctors try to heal a thing-they leave the mind out of it. They leave the emotions out of it. On the other hand, a true kaHuna healing is a holistic healing. This means that mind, body and spirit are all brought in to the healing process. There's no virtue seen in mental work alone. Unless you can use the mental work alone to produce a quick healing, you use everything. You use physical things and you use mental things. You use emotions. You use energy. You use environment. You use prayer. You use whatever helps to change the process.

You use the external things to support the internal change. The internal change is where it's all coming from. It comes from the inside out. But we can use external things to help bring that about.

DiCarlo: You state that by learning to direct thoughts and feeling we can enormously influence our bodies. What is the difference between directing thoughts and feelings and suppressing or repressing thoughts and feelings?

King: Suppressing always involves body tension. It always produces inhibition of function as well as toxic buildup. Directing is simply making clear where you want things to go and letting them go there.

DiCarlo: So there's more this sense of allowing.

King: Much more, because there is much more trust. The body knows how to heal itself. It knows perfectly well how to heal itself. It's trying to do the best it can under the burden of our fears and the angers that are produced from those fears.

DiCarlo: It seems that one's self-image and level of self-esteem is vitally connected to the quality of one's life. How can an individual change a poor self-image into a positive self-image?

King: It isn't an easy thing to do, only because it involves giving up our old ways of thinking and acting. The process itself is very simple. We only have four ways we can change anything as human beings: we can change our words; we can change the images we bring into our mind of the past or the future; we can change our feelings or our energy- many people are not familiar with how to do that, but but it can be done; and we can change our behavior. That's all we can do. All the techniques in the world use some combination of the four. So how do you change from poor self-esteem to better self-esteem? By changing the things you say about yourself, by changing the images you have of yourself in different situations, by changing the feelings about yourself, by changing the way you act in regard to yourself.

DiCarlo: So quite a bit of work is involved I take it...

King: It depends. It depends upon how willing you are to actually change your old ways of doing things-that's the only thing that makes it difficult. The more fear you have of making such changes, the more difficult it's going to be.

DiCarlo: In Earth Energies , you use the word "vril". What exactly is "vril" and what are its characteristics?

King: It is a borrowed term, used to name what's often referred to as "subtle energy". Some of its main characteristics that have been noticed by all the researchers, is its impulse to move. It is energy, and that means it's in motion. So it tends to move. It can be directed through an object like a piece of wire, or anything else. It seems to have many of the characteristics of electromagnetism and gravity-or you could say that electromagnetism and gravity have many of the characteristics of it. It does have those characteristics, but it does not seem to have their limitations.

DiCarlo: Is it the same as "life force?"

King: That's another term people have used for it, yes.

DiCarlo: Can we learn to direct the flow, intensity and effect of this energy?

King: First step is to become aware of it, and even assume that it does, in fact, exist. Then, while being aware of it, direct your intention as to what you want it to do.

DiCarlo: Is that something easily learned?

King: Yes, you can start getting direct effects of it in just a few moments. That's not hard to do at all.

DiCarlo: What would be the benefits of learning to do that?

King: Once you learn how to do it, you have much greater influence of yourself, your body, your health, your life, your feelings, your emotions, your behavior and the behavior of others. But it's influence mind you, never control.

DiCarlo: How would an individual experience vril? What would the sensation be like?

King: Very typical sensations are warmth-that's the most common one. A kind of a current flow and a tingling. Sometimes coolness. Under certain circumstances that's a perceived effect. Some people translate it into the color realm. Some people feel it as heaviness or lightness. But it's a definite physical sensation.

DiCarlo: You've stated that the amount of energy flowing in your system will determine your state of health, confidence, effect on others and achievement of goals. A small amount of personal energy flow equals small effects in life even though your subconscious has accepted your suggestions and affirmations. If that's the case, how do we increase this flow of energy moving through us?

King: Awareness. Relaxation is very important, especially when we have had a history of suppressing, and a history of building up tension that a lot of us aren't even aware of. So learning how to be much more in tune with the body. How? We do that through learning how to relax the body much more and being much more aware of our senses. So practicing sensory awareness is a very important part of this. Next, we increase our motivation for something. Focus and excitement of the energy in regard to some objective, greatly increases the flow.

DiCarlo: Would you say that increasing the flow, and learning to direct and control the flow, would be key elements of one who is personally empowered?

King: Yes.

DiCarlo: How would you define personal empowerment?

King: Personal empowerment is when you have the power to influence your experience.

DiCarlo: So rather than being a helpless and having circumstances overwhelm you, you are able to exert an influence in those very same circumstances?

King: That's right. Now that influence can be all the way from applying your own learned skill to a situation, but it is also a skill to be able to turn to spirit and let spirit do the work without interference.

DiCarlo: In Mastering Your Hidden Self, you talk about "mana". One of the aspects of mana is having skill...

King: ...Yes, because mana itself essentially means power, but when we trace that back, it comes from a meaning of authority which gives influence. So again, mana is really influence. Energy has an influence and so there is an energy connection with it, but mana itself is not energy. It is directed energy-energy doing work. The same way we use power and electricity.

DiCarlo: So vril would be the energy that would be directed which would result in mana?

King: Well, vril would be the energy itself. Vril is just electricity, which is exists in the atmosphere, or electromagnetism, which exists in the very nature of the earth itself. Mana is in putting that energy to work to accomplish some purpose. So when we use electricity to light houses-that's power. Where we use electromagnetism to heal bodies-that's power. Where we use it to run a saw to build a house-that's power.

To have the ability to be aware of the energy and then to focus the thought and focus the intent-that's where the power comes from.

DiCarlo: Is love an energy in your view?

King: Love like mana, like power, has energy aspects. Love, if you like generates energy. Love itself is not energy. Love is a behavior and a particular kind of focus of moving towards something with the conscious or unconscious intent to connect with it. That's why we define love as being happy with something or someone. The Hawaiian word "aloha" also has connotations of being in the present moment and sharing experience. It has connotations of being joyful.

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